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Villain Suggestions

villains suggestions

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#1 mogiks

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 10:18 AM

Lately I feel there is a disheartened mood on US1 server because we can't beat most of the villains that appear. This leads to a vicious circle:

 

"we can't beat any of the villains"
|
v

"there is no point attacking and spending donuts on villains anymore"

|

v

few people attack the next villain, so we lose again
|
v
back to "we can't beat any of the villains"

 

I think there are lots of ways you can fix this and also make villains more worthwhile and fun for all players, which will benefit Playata in the end by encouraging players to spend donuts on the villain.

 

So I would like to point out the flaws in the system currently, and to suggest lots of ideas. Some I thought of myself, but many are a group effort - I asked lots of players in the Hero Zero room in the Kongregate.com chat box to brainstorm new ideas and make them better so that I could compile them here on behalf of everyone. I would like to thank everyone who helped me and contributed new ideas - those who gave the most input were billy8 (Jneal57), M4598, wogalito, Firetiger, ToolShed and gamera   :) Hero Zero has a great community and I hope our suggestions can make the game better for everyone.

 

 

 

-------Lower the Villains' HP-------

First of all, please look at the statistics of how many villains we beat on US1 server, because I think our success rate is a lot lower than it should be. The amount of HP is almost always too much for us and I think the HP needs to be lowered so that the villains are easier to beat. I know you have regularly tweaked the villains' HP in the Tuesday updates so I hope that this suggestion will be easy to fulfil. I accept that there will always be some villains we cannot beat, but it would be nice to beat at least half of the villains that appear.

 

--------------------------

 

However, that is not a long-term solution.
I think the villains are fundamentally flawed because we, the players, are at the mercy of whoever decides how much HP a villain should have. I guess that you use some formula or algorithm to work out the HP, but it must be flawed because we lose so many villains recently. A formula cannot account for all factors that determine how much damage we can do to a villain.

 

You can change the formula, you can lower or raise the HP of the villains, but later on things will change again and you will have to keep changing the HP. Since we have been losing lots of villains lately and no changes to the HP have been made, I think you haven't even noticed our low success rate. If you do not monitor our success rate and just wait until people start complaining that we are losing all the villains, the changes to the HP will not be made quickly enough, which leads to players being very unhappy.

 

--------------------------

 

I believe the solution to our problems with villains is not to keep changing their HP, but to make numerous changes to the system:

1. Improve the existing rewards (coins, experience and items);
 

2. Add new incentives/rewards (new special items, special missiles, etc.);
 

3. Add new villains which last for more or less than the usual 4 or 5 hour villains, or a special villain gang (kind of like the team gang fight);
 

and most importantly:
4. Give the players ways to do more damage to villains or weaken the villain, so that if we see we are not doing enough damage to a villain, everyone can do something to improve it.

 

 

So, my suggestions:

 

----Improve the Existing Rewards----

 

MAKE THE COIN AND EXPERIENCE REWARD
LARGER FOR HIGHER LEVEL PLAYERS

Why?:
High level players feel there is not enough incentive to attack the villain because the rewards are so small. At level 250+, the amount of coin and experience earned from attacking a villain is relatively tiny compared to the amount of coin and experience needed to buy a skill point or level up, respectively. It is not worthwhile for high level players to hit the villain - they will make much more coin and experience doing missions instead.
Benefits:
High level players are more motivated to attack the villain. High level players do lots of damage, so the villain is more likely to die.

 

Example:

("Base coin/exp" = how much coin and experience they would get using the current system)
As an example, I will use a final reward of 60,000 coin and 10,000 exp.
Levels 1-50 = 100% of base coin/exp = 60,000 coin, 10,000 exp
Level 51-100 = 140% of base coin/exp = 84,000 coin, 14,000 exp
Level 101-150 = 180% of base coin/exp = 108,000 coin, 18,000 exp
Level 151-200 = 220% of base coin/exp = 132,000 coin, 22,000 exp
Level 201-250 = 260% of base coin/exp = 156,000 coin, 26,000 exp
Level 251-300 = 300% of base coin/exp = 180,000 coin, 30,000 exp

 

If possible I would particularly like the experience to be raised more, because experience is so hard to get :) Any other ways to add bonus coin or experience to your total would be really cool - like, there could be a small chance during an attack for money to fall out the villain's pocket, adding an extra 10,000 coin to your final total!

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

MAKE THE ITEMS BETTER FOR RANK #1

AND THE REST OF TOP 10

Why?:
The item received for having most number of attacks or last strike is currently not much better (is it better at all?) than an epic item received from somewhere else. The only incentive to be number 1 is getting an iron man item, which is only cosmetic. If the items are better, players will be more motivated to try to get in the top 10. This means they will be more likely to buy and spend donuts.
Benefits:
Players are more motivated to attack the villain a lot, and to buy and spend donuts on villains.

 

Example:
Player A can find epic items elsewhere in the game which have 400 stats in total (e.g. 100 strength, 100 stamina, 100 brain, 100 intuition).

Player A finishes in top 10 = reward is an item with 450 stats in total
Player A finishes in 1st place = reward is an item with 500 stats in total


-----------------------------------------------

 

CHANGE THE ITEMS GIVEN TO

FIRST PLACE AND TO TOP 10

Why?:
We've had the same Iron Man outfit for first place, and Amphibian set for Top 10, for AGES. Some players stopped caring about coming first once they had collected the entire Iron Man set. Also, the amphibian set is SO UGLY that I want to burn my eyes out every time I look at it. (I haven't burned my eyes out yet, but how much longer can I resist?)
Benefits:
New item sets will motivate item collectors to spend donuts trying to come first.

 

Example:
UDareUTake has already drawn mock ups of new item sets such as the Spiderman set. They are already designed and can be put into the game quite easily. But it doesn't even have to be a superhero-themed set. As long as the items look cool and are really rare because they're only dropped by villains, players will want to get them!

 

ALSO: The reward given for beating a holiday villain (The Easter Bunny, Santa Claus) should ALWAYS be a holiday item (e.g. a bunny suit, a santa hat.) I found the holiday items are always very hard to get without spending lots and lots of donuts. If you could definitely get a holiday item from a holiday villain, more players would be motivated to attack to get a special item!

 

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MAKE THE VILLAINS GIVE WEAPONS AND GADGETS

AS A REWARD TO PLAYERS IN THE TOP 10

Why?:
Sometimes it's hard to find epic items of the specific type you want. If you need an epic cape or an epic helm, you can just attack the villain and make sure you finish in the top 10. But because villains don't drop epic weapons or gadgets, they are harder to find than other items. It would be nice to be able to get a guaranteed weapon or gadget for being in the top 10.
Benefits:
Players who need new weapons or gadgets will be motivated to try to come first or in the top 10.

 

 

----Add New Rewards----

 

VILLAINS HAVE A SMALL CHANCE OF

DROPPING A NEW, EXPIRABLE ITEM
Why?:
Even with better items and with more coin and experience, the rewards for beating a villain can still be obtained elsewhere in the game (other than the Iron Man set, of course, but that's just cosmetic). We need something SPECIAL, with a tangible benefit to players, to make attacking the villain worthwhile. This item would not always be rewarded after a villain is beaten, but it would have a small chance of being given to a player, depending on how many attacks they did.
Benefits:
Players are more motivated to attack the villain because of a special reward unobtainable anywhere else, instead of just ignoring the villain and carrying on using their energy or training units.

 

Example:

A new "Charm" slot is added to the equipment screen. You can only have one Charm equipped at a time. Like boosters, Charms expire after a certain amount of time - say 3 days - in order to prevent giving players too much advantage.
The chance of being rewarded a Charm depends on how many attacks you did on the villain. Every 10 attacks you do is an extra 2% chance of receiving a Charm, up to a maximum of 10-20% chance
Coin Charm: gives +5% bonus to coins earned in missions.
Experience Charm: gives +5% bonus to experience earned in missions
Epic Charm: +10% chance of finding epic items
Donut Charm: +10% chance of getting a donut in a duel

And so on.

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

 

ADD A FAME BAR - FAME IS EARNED WHEN

YOU HELP TO DEFEAT A VILLAIN
Why?:
This is another way to reward players for beating villains.
Benefits:
Players are more motivated to help defeat villains.

 

Example:

A new bar is added to the character screen. This is the fame bar, which has 25 different levels, or ranks; starting at rank 25 (e.g. "Unknown"), you work your way up to rank 1 (e.g. "Ultra Famous"). You earn a small amount of fame after defeating a villain - the amount of fame you get could be random, or based on number of attacks. When you fill up the fame bar, you attain the next rank of fame and are given a choice of three different rewards. For example, for reaching rank 24, you get a choice of 5,000 coin, OR 2,000 experience, OR you can take the Gamble option which has a chance of giving you donuts or skill points, but may also give you nothing.

 

Obviously there is an overlap with the titles you get below your character name depending on what level you are. So, maybe you could call the fame bar something else.

 

This idea was inspired by the game Torchlight which has both an experience bar (for gaining levels) and a fame bar (for gaining ranks in fame). You get fame in Torchlight by completing quests and beating extra powerful enemies.

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

 

----Add Time Villains----

 

12 HOUR SUPERVILLAIN
Why?:
A lot of players can only play for a few hours a day maximum, so they miss most of the villains. This would give more players a chance to take part in beating villains. It would also increase the competition for the top ranks, so players would be more likely to spend donuts, and they would have to spend MORE donuts, in order to be at the top. This is a very popular idea among my fellow players and has already been suggested by UDareUTake here.
Benefits:
More people get a chance to hit the villain; increase competition for the top ranks, therefore more donuts are bought and spent.

 

Example:

The villain lasts for 12 hours. The top 3 players with most attacks, and the last 3 players to strike the villain, each receive an Iron Man item (or new set item) which is much better than the items obtained for most attacks or last strike on a normal villain. The amphibian item is also much better than the amphibian items given for defeating a normal villain, and rather than being only for the top 10, on a supervillain everyone in the top 30 for most attacks will receive an amphibian item.

 

Jneal suggests that the supervillains be based on monsters like Godzilla.

 

M4598 suggests a supervillain takes place in EVERY ZONE, from Humphreydale to Paris! One part of their body appears in each zone. This means all players, no matter their level, get a chance to attack the villain. Each body part has a small amount of HP. There is a small reward for beating each separate body part, and then, if we defeat all the body parts (and therefore the whole supervillain), we get a big bonus on top of the rewards we got for the body parts we helped to defeat. I like this idea so much I put it in red. Red like the blood of all the supervillain bodyparts I want to slaughter > :D

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

 

1-2 HOUR MINION/MINI-VILLAIN
Why?:
If we have supervillains, it would be nice to have shorter villains to contrast with them. We already have these short villains appearing sometimes during the holidays. They are popular because they don't take a lot of time to beat, so even players who don't have much time to play can stay and attack the whole way through.
Benefits:
Short villains will be over quickly so players won't get bored of attacking. There will also be a brisk race to end in the top 10, which will probably involve spending donuts.

 

Example:

Jneal suggested that if we fail to beat a villain, several minions appear for a time period of 2 hours after the original villain flees. Each minion is much weaker than a real villain - for example, they each last for 2 hours but have only 2 million HP - but there are many of them. For each one we defeat, we get 10% of the rewards we would have got from the original villain. This is a nice way to make players happier after the disappointment of losing a villain.

 

You could also just have normal villains who last for only 1-2 hours, like the ones we get during the holidays, but all year round instead :)

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

 

VILLAIN GANG - A NUMBER OF VILLAINS IN QUICK SUCCESSION,

EACH ONE STRONGER THAN THE LAST
Why?:
Another way to shake up the villain system. All of the rewards for each villain adds up, so that we have a chance to earn great rewards, IF we manage to beat them all.
Benefits:
Better rewards than a normal villain, so more incentive to attack and spend donuts; the first ones are weaker than normal villains, so easier to beat; something new which will make attacking villains fun again.

 

Example:

This is an idea by ToolShed: A villain with low HP appears. It lasts for one hour. If we beat the first villain, another one comes which has a little more HP for the same time. Again, if we beat it, another stronger one appears - until the whole gang of villains has been beaten (say a maximum of five villains in the gang), or until we have lost one of them, in which case the next one does not appear. At the end, you get all the rewards for each one you defeated added up - full coin and experience from every villain you defeated, and half coin and experience from the last one if it fled. You also get an item - or possibly multiple items, one for each villain that was defeated.

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

 

----Give the Players Ways to Do More Damage to Villains, or Weaken Villains----

 

ADD POWER ATTACKS - THESE COST

3-5 ENERGY BUT DO EXTRA DAMAGE
Why?:
We need ways for players to do more damage when we have fallen behind on the villain. Currently, if players think we are not doing enough damage, there's nothing they can do except ask other players to attack the villain too. This way, players can be more active in doing more damage. Players could sacrifice a small amount of energy to do more damage - energy is an abundant commodity and many don't have time to spend all their energy + refills, so it would definitely be worth it.
Benefits:
Players have more control over the amount of damage they do, which means we can beat more of them, thus motivating players to attack villains more.

 

Example:

There is now another button to attack the V for the power attack. It takes the same amount of time as a normal attack, however it costs 3-5 energy (depending on what booster you have). Maybe you could also do an instant power attack which costs both energy and donuts - a combination of an instant donut attack and a power attack.
The power attack does twice as much damage as a normal attack.

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

 

SPECIAL MISSIONS DURING THE

2-4 HOUR PERIOD BEFORE A VILLAIN
Why?:
These special missions give us another way to do extra damage or weaken the villain. In a way, they are helping us to prepare for the villain, and they also give hints that a villain will soon be here.
Benefits:
More ways to do extra damage/weaken the villain. It also adds a preparation element, where players earn the right to do more damage or make the villain weaker by doing special missions. This would be especially fun. And the appearance of the special missions would herald the arrival of a villain, giving everyone warning so that all players can be at their computers to attack!

 

Example:

During the two hours (or maybe four) before a villain appears, there is a small chance (5% for example) of a special mission appearing. These have a special icon so the player will notice them easily. It is kind of like the missions that appear with clues that allow you to start the special missions. But in this case, the reward for doing the mission is related to the villain. The mission text will be something like:

"You have decoded a secret radio transmission which suggests that [villain name] is going to attack soon! Run to the library and research [villain name]'s weaknesses so that you can defeat him before he carries out his dastardly plan!"

Reward: The player (or all members of a player's team) does an extra +50% damage to the villain in all attacks. OR, all players on the server do an extra 500 damage per attack.

OR

"You find a pigeon in the street with a message tied to its leg! It says that [villain name] plans to rob the bank in [area name]! Hurry and lay a trap for him - perhaps a spike pit in the alley outside will weaken him a little before you and your buddies can attack him!"

Rewards: The villain starts with 200,000 less HP.

 

Jneal suggests that one of the rewards for this sort of special mission is a type of toxic missile which deals extra poison damage (e.g. 100 poison damage per minute) if you attack the villain with the toxic missiles equipped. Since these would be very powerful, I suggest they are not usable on other players or missions.

 

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SUPERPOWERS

Why?:
Another way to do extra damage or weaken the villain.
Benefits:
Through extra efforts, players can obtain a way to make the villain weaker - it's an incentive both to play the game longer each day, and to attack a villain!

 

Example:

If I understand correctly, ToolShed suggests a server-wide buff whereby, if enough people train a certain stat before the villain appears, everyone is able to do more damage, or the villain is weaker in some way. Or it could be an item which requires multiple people's cooperation to use, in order to take away 10% of the villain's health. But - hard to obtain, or it recharges very slowly, so you can't use it all the time.

 

I am thinking of an item, say a Power Orb, that is made up of several parts - these parts can be found very rarely during normal activities in the game. The point is to collect all the parts of the orb, and then you gain a superpower which allows you to do an attack which does a huge amount of damage - say 500,000 HP. The orb parts would be very rare, either you'd have to collect them on your own or you could put them together with other people or as a team. 

 

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MORE DAMAGE IN THE LAST HALF HOUR OF THE VILLAIN/
REDUCING THE VILLAIN'S HP BY 25% ADDS
EXTRA TIME TO THE CLOCK

Why?:
I already said why, have you got the message yet?
Benefits:
Same benefits. Yawn.

 

Example:

Self-explanatory, no? I just lumped these two ideas together because I am bored now.

 

-----------------------------------------------

 

So, in summary. Change the villains. Please. PLEASE CHANGE SOMETHING, ANYTHING ABOUT THE VILLAINS. That would be wonderful. And that is all I have to say. Thanks for reading.


  • A T R, UDareUTake, zaobrioak and 4 others like this

#2 M4598

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 10:36 AM

So impressed with the size of the post, the amount of good ideas (missed the discussion of some of them) that i can't even start to say which is better. Other way. even without adding anything, i can already say that i agree to summary, things need to be changed.



#3 A T R

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 11:14 AM

From what I have heard apperance and health of a Villain is related to the number of persons online, problem being that players do not log out & many of the higher levels ( as stated above ) do not attack.

 

 

On a personal level the entire villain system is meh, unless it is improved I would be dandy with it being removed.

 

 

Mogiks< Wonderful post and collection of suggestions.



#4 ToolShed

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 11:37 AM

I'm not actually entirely sure where I was going with the superpower idea, but I definitely feel it should be limited to one use per villain as it would hopefully be rather powerful. Perhaps there could be multiple superpowers, one when activated could allow every player 2 or 3 instant attacks? Another could, as mogiks suggested, remove a chunk of health. One could for the rest of the fight give everyone a heightened chance of dodging or landing a critical hit. Maybe another could reduce the time necessary to attack the villain for everyone for the rest of the fight. just some thoughts. No real opinion on the others, they all seem rock solid as it is.


Edited by ToolShed, 14 April 2013 - 11:49 AM.


#5 LOGGEDin

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 12:31 PM

I admire the effort mogiks put in this collection of great ideas on improving fun with the villains in this game.

My favourites are the expirable items (smaller or faster expiring ones could be given to even more than the top 10 attackers), the fame bar, the super-/mini-villains, and the power attacks for energy.

And I actually assumed that the coin and experience rewards were already like mogiks described them (higher for higher level players). If not, they should be adjusted immediately.


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Es ist nicht Deine Schuld dass die Welt ist wie sie ist.
Es wär nur Deine Schuld wenn sie so bleibt!
(DÄ)


#6 UDareUTake

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Posted 14 April 2013 - 04:29 PM

Like what mogiks said, ANY CHANGES to the villain would mean alot to the players.. its getting boring to see villains since they dun give me any improvement for most of my items, and will take an additional 4-5 hours ontop my usual routine of 4 refills and trainings



#7 Midulf

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Posted 17 April 2013 - 12:47 AM

mogiks, your ideas are excellent, it took me a while to read the long post, hope the devs will take the same effort to read it and maybe improve this lovely game ;) :) cheers!



#8 jbbill1

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 05:37 PM

if the herozero team dont agree ILL GO ON STRIKE WHOS WITH ME!

 

love your ideas especially agree with "Also, the amphibian set is SO UGLY that I want to burn my eyes out every time I look at it. (I haven't burned my eyes out yet, but how much longer can I resist?)"  



#9 andromeda

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Posted 09 December 2013 - 12:57 PM

nice,..



#10 Stalemate

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Posted 09 December 2013 - 01:18 PM

just a little off topic but if you will not change the items sets amphibian/iron man then at least make them wipstichable without losing the bonuses. Also good idea's wogs.

P.S. Please change the set items up a bit just 2 sets for the last 5-6 months I've been playing you do have other ideas people have been posting please consider these.







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